Re: [jats-list] Can an Editor Write Schematron?

Subject: Re: [jats-list] Can an Editor Write Schematron?
From: "Lizzi, Vincent vincent.lizzi@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx" <jats-list-service@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Fri, 12 Feb 2021 15:38:13 -0000
Hi Gareth,

It certainly is possible to transform Schematron with XSLT into a spreadsheet
to create documentation. The feedback loop that you describe could work very
well as a workflow.

Kind regards,
Vincent

_____________________________________________
Vincent M. Lizzi
Head of Information Standards | Taylor & Francis Group
vincent.lizzi@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:vincent.lizzi@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>



Information Classification: General
From: Gareth Oakes goakes@xxxxxxx <jats-list-service@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, February 11, 2021 6:03 PM
To: jats-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [jats-list] Can an Editor Write Schematron?

Codifying the logic as English statements in a spreadsheet seems like a good
approach. I wonder if you can "sync" this with the Schematron by generating
English language statements from the Schematron asserts/reports? That way once
the programmer interprets the latest spreadsheet they can regenerate the
spreadsheet from the Schematron file, ready for the next time an editor wants
to update the spreadsheet. This gives a handy point of reference for the
current logic as well as a clue to the type of language (and thought process)
the editor should be using.



// Gareth Oakes

// VP Content Technologies, GPSL

// www.gpsl.co<http://www.gpsl.co>



o;?On 12/2/21, 08:55, "Debbie Lapeyre
dalapeyre@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:dalapeyre@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>"
<jats-list-service@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:jats-list-service@xxxxxxxxxx
errytech.com>> wrote:



Flip answer: Yes if they know XPath.



More useful answer:



1) They are more likely to RUN Schematron, as set up

by programmers, than to write it. Whole test suites

can be set up for them to run single-click.



2) But, they can also SPECIFY Schematron (in a natural language such as

English) IN A SPREADSHEET that tells the programmers what to check and

what error message the Editors want back.



The editors are in charge of the requirements document (the spreadsheet).

The programmers are in charge of interpreting those requirements in

Schematron and of updating the spreadsheet to say which module(s)

check each requirement.



Some basic spreadsheet logic of giving each request a unique

number, error severity (such as editorial error, XML error | human must

look at this one, caution, fatal, make up whatever categories you

think are useful), status, QA or management signoff flag, whatever

you need is useful.



This is a very handy system that works well for many. Most

Editors know spreadsheets. There are no pointy brackets in sight.

It has the additional psychological advantage that the Editors

feel that the programmers are working for them, finding the

errors Editors want fixed, not imposing rules from above.



--dal





> On Feb 11, 2021, at 5:30 PM, Gareth Oakes
goakes@xxxxxxx<mailto:goakes@xxxxxxx>
<jats-list-service@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:jats-list-service@xxxxxxxxxx
errytech.com>> wrote:

>

> Sorry to jump in but that is an interesting thought. I suspect your average
PE would get stuck on the fact that you need to know XPath and be quite
familiar with the JATS schema in order to create good Schematron assertions or
reports. I wonder if there is a UI solution that would help in this case
though? I'm not aware of one but am interested to hear from others. It would
sure save the trouble of having an XML person come in to define and maintain
those basic editorial rules.

>

> I think the pre-requisites for Schematron are experience with XML, good
knowledge of XPath, and working knowledge of the schema you are writing rules
against.

>

> // Gareth Oakes

> // VP Content Technologies, GPSL

> // www.gpsl.co<http://www.gpsl.co>

>

> On 12/2/21, 06:44, "Charles O'Connor
coconnor@xxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:coconnor@xxxxxxxxxxxx>"
<jats-list-service@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:jats-list-service@xxxxxxxxxx
errytech.com>> wrote:

>

> Hi Liam,

>

>

>

> When the Schematron course comes together, please ping me off list.

>

>

>

> I did a webinar yesterday on our (Aries) XML-through production workflow,
which includes the ability to configure a task to run Schematron. Question
from a participant was, "This Schematron thing sounds cool, but is it
something the average production editor could write?"

>

>

>

> My answer was that a somewhat ambitious one certainly could. There may also
be interest among others at Aries.

>

>

>

> Also, let me know whether there are prerequisites beyond a basic knowledge
of what XML is and how it works.

>

>

>

> Thanks,

>

> Charles

>

>

>

> -----Original Message-----

>

> From: Liam R. E. Quin liam@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:liam@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
<jats-list-service@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:jats-list-service@xxxxxxxxxx
errytech.com>>

>

> Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2021 2:55 PM

>

> To: jats-list
<jats-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:jats-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>>

>

> Subject: [jats-list] [ANN] XSLT 3 training - dates for February, March,
April 2021

>

>

>

> *** External email: use caution ***

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> I'll be running XSLT 3 training on

>

> * 23rd, 24th, 25th of February,

>

> (likely in CET times, e.g. 09:30-15:00 depending on numbers of

>

> people)

>

>

>

> * 23rd, 24th, 25t of March,

>

> * 27th, 28th, 28th of April

>

>

>

> The courses are live video (not pre-recorded); classes are limited to eight
people at a time. Shoes optional :)

>

>

>

> There's a course overview at

>

> https://www.delightfulcomputing.com/<https://www.delightfulcomputing.com>

>

>

>

> In addition, i know you've been missing XML Prague, so a Schematron course
is in the works.

>

>

>

> The single most important thing to me in teaching is empowerment:

>

> helping people to see how to find their own answers, and to go out into the
world and solve new problems.

>

>

>

> Liam

>

>

>

> PS: there's some flexibility in the dates, and the time of day can be
adjusted to meet your needs, depending on who is participating.

>

>

>

>

>

> --

>

> Liam Quin,
https://www.delightfulcomputing.com/<https://www.delightfulcomputing.com/>

>

> Available for XML/Document/Information Architecture/XSLT/
XSL/XQuery/Web/Text Processing/A11Y training, work & consulting.

>

> Barefoot Web-slave, antique illustrations:
http://www.fromoldbooks.org<http://www.fromoldbooks.org>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>



================================================================

Deborah A Lapeyre mailto:dalapeyre@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Mulberry Technologies, Inc.
http://www.mulberrytech.com<http://www.mulberrytech.com>

17 West Jefferson Street Phone: 301-315-9631 (USA)

Suite 207 Fax: 301-315-8385

Rockville, MD 20850

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